@adam instead of thinking of defederating, perhaps maybe reach out to micro.blog and ask them to fix their implementation? Maybe, there is a bug they are not aware of?

@adam If it’s been reported as a bug, I would give them some time to respond to it before acting.

But, if it’s been reported and it’s either working as designed or they won’t fix it, I’d vote for defederating.

@adam I see no reason to defederate. I’m old and from a time when people could talk shit about me on some blog post that I’ll never be aware of, so this doesn’t feel that much different.

@adam Ick. My vote (are we voting?) is to defederate.

@ezwal @adam The behavior around blogs was and is expected, though.

@adam I’ve been in favor of individually blocking servers, and OMG.lol having a “Hall of Shame” doc with servers to block, the reason, and instructions on how to do so. But, my goodness, Micro.blog is really pushing it with their broken AF ActivityPub implementation. 🙃

@adam The fact that you say that this is actually an intended feature and not a bug makes me deeply uncomfortable. Eough so that I'm going to talk with my partner over on our own instance to see if we de-federate from them.

This is not what I want from the fediverse, personally.

@adam Ugh this is a huge bummer. I have a couple people who I do get replies from that I’d be disappointed to cut off, but the fact they allow this creepy behavior is really discouraging.

@toddz @adam Good point! I also have enough privilege that someone talking smack about me online doesn’t really affect me.

@adam Yeah makes sense. See my other response too.

If people want to defederate, that’s cool too.

@adam Isn't there a feature which let's you stop pushing entries to your instance but doesn't stop connection which are already present?

If think of this feature:

"Is there a less drastic alternative to blocking?

Yes, you can choose Limit from the Severity menu instead of Suspend. Limiting (also known as Silencing) does not cut off connections, and allows follows to carry on, but it hides all posts from that server unless people are following the account that makes them."

@adam hmm am I misinterpreting this? Do you mean only non-federated micro.blog accounts?

I just did a quick test under a post from social.lol and a reply from my (federated) micro.blog account and I can see it from Ivory?

https://social.lol/@jglypt/114717037226151885

https://micro.blog/j4ck/67234904

@adam what the actual fuck. I had no idea about this

@mbjones @adam oh yeah that is uh.. strange.

I'm not sure whether it's worth blocking the entire instance for though.. it's definitely weird, but then I feel like if people are following other Fediverse accounts, surely it's more likely that they have actually federated their micro.blog account?

iirc when you signup to Micro.blog, it federates you by default, so for someone to turn that off I think they'd be more likely not to reply to a Fedi post

idk i always feel weird about instances blocking others (unless it's for an obvious reason like nazis etc..) but this is an issue 😅

also, it's bad that Manton makes it seem like a purposeful decision

@adam Obviously I have my own history with M.B. And Manton which resulted in me leaving that platform due to his conduct.

That being said, I think you hit the nail on the head about expectations for federation. If you’re in you’ve got to be in all the way and allow a right of reply.

It is absolutely irresponsible and poor conduct.

@adam also I am soooo looking at enabling the option immediately to stop my content federating there after hearing about this.

@adam Is that correct?

I do not see an option to at reply without sending the response back to the fediverse on the page that you linked.

I do see an option to mute replies from the fediverse on that user’s micro blog timeline.

I’m sure if this is not functioning as per the snip they will correct this if you reach out, as what you describe feels like pretty undesirable behaviour?

@adam But in my understanding (a) blocking means we have to exchange between social.lol and micro.blog and (b) limiting there might be problems but there are ways to have exchange between social.lol and micro.blog.

I would prefer (b).

I would prefer (b) because i'm using omg.lol *and* micro.blog.
I would prefer (b) as co-moderator of hannover.town

I prefer (b) because the chance of interaction is better as locked doors.

Just my 5 euro cent!

@adam similar thing, but for all instances running glitch-soc Mastodon:

https://catcatnya.com/@navi/114717140436173561

you can't access the link though, and on timelines, as well as in some Fedi clients (Moshidon), it's explicitly marked as local-only (on web, it's a house icon next to the visibility icon on the timeline).

Here's a screenshot.

@adam
Wana hear something funny? The same behavior applies to the whole fediverse and can be intended
For example:
- I can restrict my post to not federate, altho thats a Akkoma (maybe also Pleroma) specific Feature, Misskey does support that too i think, its once again just Mastodon which dont support local posts only
- Beside of that, under certain circumstances within the protocol, a blocked instance can still get a post, replies then wont be accepted by the origin server, the person who made the reply wont get notified. And this behavior can even happen on user block level if the block isnt properly federated or the replying server ignores user blocks from remote instances.
- Another way is that Users can configure their Account in a way that they wont see the replies
- One kinda different but somewhat similiar thing can be Quotes, think of Quotes like a proper Link Preview, the original poster doesnt have to be tagged (neither in replies)

So, the whole situation basically boils down to a situation that within the fediverse you cant assume that the original author knows every reply. Thats intended, thats protocol, you cant change that, its a technical limitation, that cant even be fixed with the best developer writing the best code on earth and invents the best protocol on earth. Thats basically the downside of federation.
Sorry to say so

There is a way to get in control of posts, but it is extremely hard to enforce:
- Instead of allowing your instance to federate with anyone, make a allowlist
- Prevent outsiders (which dont have an account) that they cant see any post on your server, basically if i open your instance, the only thing which should show up is the login page
- make sure that every instance you federate with, have the same behavior, otherwise your posts can get leaked to public and you loose control

@mbjones @adam I don’t see a setting that permits at replies to not be sent out to fedi though.

I think the answer lies elsewhere in the thread you linked. If the user has deleted their activitypub profile, but is following mastodon accounts, then they could theoretically reply in this way, without those replies ever leaving.

Had not really considered that possibility before - it feels pretty undesirable, but probably dates back much further than the features introduced in feb.

@adam Let me make a small comparison: The Fediverse works like E-Mail. With all the issues from E-Mails, and even more due to its newer and it doesnt have certain stuff which got invented for E-Mail years ago.

@adam @nileane Yeah this is fucked. Not only is the feature kind of gross on its own but they are actively using it in a malicious way too. So it's on purpose.

@adam Hi Adam, I brought it up with our mods here: https://tech.lgbt/@h5e/114717042903142433

You might find it interesting, especially Amber’s post, who looked into this behaviour.

@adam I can’t really brain today so I cannot answer that question with my thoughts on it, sorry

@adam @mbjones it’s difficult to know for sure, but the functionality today does not seem to permit that out of the box. I see only three options - send all, send only at replies, mute all incoming. So I assume deactivated the activitypub profile.

@adam @noa Dont worry, i give you a real world example on top of it:
E-Mails do have flags, for example the confidential flag in outlook:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/office/mark-your-email-as-normal-personal-private-or-confidential-in-outlook-4a76d05b-6c29-4a0d-9096-71784a6b12c1

Certain organizations with a higher security perceive actually use these flags, if a E-Mail is marked as confidential, their server wont send outside of the company, the same behavior you described.

But anyway, i would like to thank you for reading my messages, very often most of the people / admins dont give a damn thing on what i write.

It is not my goal to influence what you block or don’t block, my goal is to make people realize that the Fediverse can work very differently than most people assume.

Fedi is a wonderful privacy nightmare

@adam defederate. This „feature” is really bad.

@adam Yiiiiikes. That's creepy *and* shady as fuck.
Thanks for the examples.

@macmanx @adam Yeah I agree with the opt-in blocking “Hall of Shame” concept and think I’ll be blocking Micro.blog myself.

@manton Trouble is, if it’s behaving the way he says, he won’t see that.

@devilgate @manton I’m on social.lol and I can see it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

@adam First of all, maybe you should focus on your own stuff and stop attacking micro.blog. Or, in shorter form: get a life. Or: stop being an asshole. I’ve never been a fan of bullies, and you definitely are one. Knock it off.

@adam Folks got really upset because services use local only as an attempt to be private. It’s not, but some services act that way. Combined with mechanics of only followers etc, things get very confusing. I saw the original person furious that Micro.blog members could reply to a post they thought was more private. Frankly, I think it’s a problem in how Mastodon talks about privacy expectations (which aren’t realistic) and it creates a lot of weird.

@adam Replying without notifying someone is sort of a form of anti-quote post— I’m referencing your content but not intending to brigade you as an individual.

I like quote posts, and frankly think all of this is trying hard to make something public not public in a way that doesn’t work. But I think it’s not as clean as you’ve been stating.

@adam I guess what I’m saying is I don’t believe this is as laden with intention as you might think. I think it’s two badly designed features interacting in a weird way. But I don’t want to either white knight or brigade on this one— just trying to point out that AP and Mastodon in particular create a lot of conditions where behavior is ill defined unless you’re just running an exact clone of Mastodon. Part of why I’m pretty meh on Mastodon as some kind of special thing.

@adam Yes, I AM aware of that interaction, and it is where I first determined that you are a bully. In fact, I decided to avoid investigating social.lol thanks to you and your “followers.” I am avoiding social media, yes – X, Facebook, Threads, etc – I do not consider micro.blog social media, although you are doing a damn fine job of turning it into the ugly places that I am avoiding. Good job. Now, the idea that you are somehow the arbiter of “the spirit of ActivityPub” raises in my mind the question of how you were given such a responsibility. So enlighten me – remove my ignorance, which you assume.

@adam Don’t even start with that shit.

@adam Am I being clear?

@adam and so have you. Now move along, pal.

@adam Indeed, I did. I’m like a dog that patrols the boundaries and barks at intruders. Unfortunately, pride (or a lack of humility, or common decency) are what’s wrong with people like you. You think you somehow have complete ownership of the universe’s moral compass and that your job is to wag your fingers at everyone like some 17th century Puritan. Here’s my principle: everyone – even you, my self-righteous acquaintance – is allowed to have thoughts and opinions in their private life without it impacting their job. You don’t. You’re like ICE of the internet out accosting people with whom you disagree and trying to have them removed from the country.

So no, i won’t stop replying. And what’s really cool is that I’m retired, so I have all day to keep replying.

So here’s YOUR chance, as the visitor here: stop replying to me. I promise I won’t do some dumb shit like declaring “victory” or whatever.

@adam You’re the interloper. I live here. I’m retired and have all the time in the world. So enjoy – it’s gonna be a long weekend.

@purplerabbit Oh! How cute! A meme! Have you ever read a book?

@whakkee Seriously, you blocked everybody on Micro.blog? That’s a substantial part of your community. I mean if you think it’s warranted more power to you, but I don’t really understand the complaint. y

@danielpunkass people live in their bubbles

@adam @sashk https://www.manton.org/2025/02/12/new-fediverse-settings-in-microblog.html
he mentions that feature here, that link inside the first link

@adam @sashk Seems like a great way to dunk on people from Mastodon with none of the repercussions.

Y'know, like throwing a stone and hiding your hand.

@adam @manton

Are you going to change your name or do you just really like Adam Lanza?