Given the state of US politics, wouldn’t now be an ideal time for the creation and launch of a new political party? The two “products” on offer seem to leave a wide space for a new entrant into the market. 🤔

@jthingelstad Constitutionally, the US system is not designed to have more than two parties. So any new entrant will have to replace an existing one. So until then you have to keep voting for the lesser "evil" or take active measures to replace the "more evil" one.

@pratik it's not just that-- a lot of people don't like the two current parties, but when you look at actual ideological preferences, there is no third axes of things that any group of people are for. The complaints about parties do not reflect missing ideological grounds, generally, but frustrations with some combinations of aesthetics and systemic structural constraints to either party being successful at achieving its goals.

@pratik I don't believe the Constitution is the problem. Some of the founders were against the idea of having any parties. There are changes in voting systems that I can imagine creating more of an opening for alternative parties. But I'd agree that the two-party system is now so embedded that it's hard to imagine a change.

@JMaxB @jsonbecker I'm not sure I agree. At least at the federal level, as long as the chamber that prioritizes land over people requires a > majority (why 60 and not 67 (2/3rds)?)for any legislation and the presidential election allocates all electoral votes to the party with most (not majority) votes, I don't see two-party rule going away. Also, imagine if the 13th Amendment would even pass today given where the ERA is currently stuck.

@pratik How a state allocates its electoral votes is up to that state, not the US Constitution. Some states already do divide up their electoral college votes in proportion to the votes cast. Other states are moving in that direction precisely because of this problem.

@fgtech Right now, only Nebraska and Maine divvy up their electoral votes, right? I don’t think any large states will do that unless all of them do it. Coz that reduces their political impact. Why would Texas risk divvy up their votes and give some to Dems when now they get them all? Likewise for California.

@pratik Right, winner takes all. This is the exact thinking that leads to our current two-party system.

This effort seems to have fizzled, but you might be interested to learn about the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact. A creative approach to this intractable problem.

@fgtech Yup. That’s what I was alluding to in my first response. There are plenty of common sense solutions but I don’t see a political will for it (for now). Right now, voting rights and the very essence of democracy is at stake. Let’s first get rid of the fascists then we can worry about more than two parties.

@pratik I don't know that our consitutional system was "designed" for two and only two major political parties but I can't disagree that it seems locked in now. I can offer that I thought the Berlin Wall was a "permanent feature" of central Europe, but it turns out, no! :-)

@JMaxB Changing the voting system is a promising avenue. Have a look at Ranked Choice as one alternative.

@bkryer There are many organizations that have been pushing for these reforms. I like represent.us the best. They have a video that explains how to make this happen state by state and how changes in the past (suffrage, gay marriage) have always started out slow until hitting a point then rapidly accelerate.

@patbak I'll check the reference link, thx. Alot seems to be happening in the space. I know of a least one credible lets-establish-a-new-third-party effort that has these sorts of issues front and center.

I should note that I am often perhaps more optimistic than warranted about what might be possible in the US because of having lived abroad for so long.

I mean, look at the Greens in Germany. They went from being not taken seriously at all (beards and sandals in parliment) to now being kind of a boring stodgy establishment party--which is great!--since there is a strong overlap of my values in their's. It was cool to watch that unfold over 20 some odd years.

Why couldn't it happen here? :-) Rationality, Compassion, Evolution, Progression, these arent' just words, right?

@bkryer I think that the parliamentary system makes this much easier, but I am hopeful RCV can at least reduce the 2 party system to in name only. The “independent “ category is the biggest it’s ever been, but seems to have less and less representation. There is also a group of Republicans (https://renewamericamovement.com/) that want to “take back” their party. I think they know forming a third party might be necessary, but they aren’t there yet. I don’t agree with all of there policy positions, but at least they are trying…The only thing worse that a 2 party system is a one party system.